Enter discipleship

bullying is endemic because ultimately, we live in a system set up by and run by bullies

the strategies schools teach to deal with bullies are so ineffective because if they taught actual, functional ways to stand up for oneself and stop bullies in their tracks, the system would no longer be able to perpetuate itself

to build off this, the strategies glorified and perpetuated are:
- don't be a target (victim blaming, tacitly endorses bully's behavior)
- ask the bully to stop (acknowledge their power over you, which reinforces that their tactics work as a way to gain power)

also, sometimes bystanders are asked to intervene - this is incredibly situational, because it assumes that bullying occurs in public places, that standing up will not be punished, and that enough people will do so for it to work

the publicized strategies are what they are because they are entirely consistent with neoliberal ideals. either reshape yourself so you don't stand out (and based on what people are often bullied for, become a model worker drone for the system), or submit to the power of the system and only take actions that the system permits - certainly don't resist in any meaningful, effective way that could force the bully to stop, because that would make you just as bad as them

often, bullying behaviours are also endorsed by the faculty - not only teachers bringing in their own bigotries (a whole other topic), but actively encouraging competition and shaming behavior w/r/t grades, sports, extracurriculars - because those are "objective" (read: capitalistically useful) measures of success and prestige. at this point, even the sanctioned methods of resistance can be punished. and we wonder why there's a mental health crisis in schools

the specific strategy my high school endorsed was "name it claim it stop it", which was exactly what it sounds like - name the behavior, explain that it's not ok, then say stop

of course this immediately became a joke among the student body, because everyone knew it wouldn't work

by making resistance seem impossible, these lessons ensure that real strategies can't take hold, in the same way that fetishism of the voting booth erases the contributions and potential of collective organization

@velexiraptor its honestly really evil how many kids in america get suspended or expelled because they get hit or beat up and caught and schools have zero tolerance policies so anyone in a fight gets in trouble

@velexiraptor This is beautiful. I'd like to embed (and quote) what you wrote here on my blog, if that's cool with you.

@velexiraptor I remember when my son was being bullied in middle school due to gendered norms around voice timbre; the "advice" everyone from teachers to his mom was giving him was so pathetically useless and would have just made it worse. Luckily, I'd had an experience myself as a teen that gave me *enough* of a grasp to give him practical advice, but you've put it very clearly and succinctly. Thank you!

@velexiraptor
Not go promote electoral politics but if you ran, I'd vote.

@velexiraptor once upon a time in grade school I and another student were 1. Taken out of class to do regular practice sessions to hide our disruptively severe speech impediments 2. Intense targets of bullying.

They tried to make us read(!) In front of our classes(!) Some Very Special picture book about tolerance.

I hid rather than comply. Idk his fate. Our paths diverged at that point and I really (still) feel like I threw him to the wolves

@velexiraptor anyway cosigned about how """confrontation""" tactics reemphasize the bully's position over you

@velexiraptor

If you can stand up to bullies, you could stand up to your boss.

@velexiraptor @moonman
>we live in a system set up by and run by bullies
Are you saying that everyone is a bully ?

>are so ineffective
Really ? Could you please provide documentation ?

>functional ways to stand up for oneself and stop bullies in their tracks
Well it all depends on the methods proposed, for example I'm not sure that going with the law of talion would be a positive/effective way to stop even more retaliation to continue.

@mangeurdenuage @moonman @velexiraptor Are everyone setting up and running things? No. So I doubt that it was claimed that everyone is a bully

@byllgrim @mangeurdenuage obviously not everyone is running things? not everyone is in charge, or has large amounts of power, and I think that's self-evident if you've taken even one course in any sort of history class (or have read literally any news article from any source).

@velexiraptor Yep, Trump is just the Chief Executive Bully, President of the United Bullies and Commander in Bullying

@velexiraptor @bgcarlisle the people telling me bullying is not part of the system but single cases make me very angry.

@AzureKingfisher @velexiraptor @bgcarlisle Could you direct me to some articles that define "the system", define "bullying", shows how the latter can be "part" of the former, and provides evidence for that it actually is like that, where it is like that, to what degree, etc.

@byllgrim @bgcarlisle cursory googling of "bullying endemic" brings up a vast amount of articles and literature not only centered on schools, but in the workplace at well. i did not write this post as an extension of or rebuttal to any single source, but as an outgrowth of previous non-specific reading in the area combined with personal experience.

@velexiraptor Could you possibly expound on functional ways to stand up for oneself and stop bullies in their tracks?

@rah that's difficult, because i have lots of experience with stuff that didn't work and almost none with stuff that does (i spent my high school experience keeping my head down to avoid bullies, which was really bad for me in a lot of ways), but something that I see recommended is embarrassing them, which rings very true. Unfortunately, the other strategy that I could see working is having a lot of people on your side - but bullies choose isolated targets for exactly that reason

@velexiraptor Indeed. And so it is with the bigger bullies running the system. If the human race had developed functional methods to stop bullies, they would be used to not only counter school bullies but those running the system. Alas.

@velexiraptor I find that the claims in this thread are a bit too vague in comparison to how big the claims are. There seem to be some "jumps" made to fit the brevity of this posting format. And I'm uncertain of whether the claims would add up to be consistent, especially if all the holes where filled out and terms and concepts were thoroughly defined before being used.

I like the style of scientific papers, but that could be too much to ask. Do you have a blog post on it?

@byllgrim gonna be honest here, this thread wasnt intended to blow up the way it has or be at all rigorous, just thoughts on personal experiences - however, the number of people who this rings true for (see the other comments) says that there's something here.

@byllgrim ive got a lot of actual work to do for work/class, so no, I don't have an actual paper written on this nor do I intend to do so, and exhaustively defining all the terms I used is not a fit for this platform (and 500 char posts especially because the very use of the terms isnt intended to be scientifically rigorous - words have meanings that people understand, that's why we use them as shorthand.

@velexiraptor
All fascist regimes, including capitalism, work like this.
I, the upper class, kick you, rob you, deceive you. Now, you, middle class, boss, etc, go find someone, in lower position than you, in the social hierarchy, and you kick them, rob them deceive them, to make up for some of the losses (financial and sentimental).
The lower class has no one to kick, rob, deceive. But an illusion of the above can be maintained. That's where a small "scapegoat like" community gets selected and crushed.
It was the Christians for the Romans, the witches for the Christians, the Jews for the Nazis, the immigrants today.
Yes, bullying is systemic, and yes, it is essential in maintaining the social hierarchy.
. . .
#anarchy #communism

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